tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post5751580748928506667..comments2023-08-22T16:18:38.393+01:00Comments on Rail Thing - Friends of the S&D: a different viewUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger19125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-19123848979434319312012-02-25T17:57:47.402+00:002012-02-25T17:57:47.402+00:00Just seen the new photos of the Gartell. At their ...Just seen the new photos of the Gartell. At their present rate of progress they'll be at Midford in 2013 and Bath the year after, and down to Bournemouth the year after that..!! I think they used to call it Empire Building...Keith Browningnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-64847165764479616542012-02-24T15:19:41.515+00:002012-02-24T15:19:41.515+00:00A pipedream? Nah, I don't think all these peop...A pipedream? Nah, I don't think all these people giving up their time and money would be involved if we weren't 100% sure it's going to happen! No-one has yet explained exactly how we will get around without the S&D in the future - we were inspired to start up because we were worried that the S&D would be rebuilt by Network Rail without any sympathy towards the original line. I'll be honest, if I thought there was even a 1% chance of it not happening I'd not waste a second of my time on it and would just concentrate on making money! We don't really hear this any more, people mmainly just encourage us to get on with it.<br /><br />I'm probably the UK's biggest metre-gauge fan and fully expect this guage to become very popular in the UK for secondary routes both restored Beeching cuts and total new builds but never for the S&D. We'd have the transhipment problem wherever we met the standard gauge network which I feel would wipe out any financial advantage the lower construction and operating costs of metre gauge would give us. I know there are transporter wagons but we'd still then have to build everything to SG loading gauge - probably even bigger as you'd have to take into account the extra height of the transhipoment vehicle.<br /><br />I do however think metre gauge would be ideal for feeder lines to the S&D, possibly (and I'll get shot for this!) one or some of the branches. But that's only my point of view!Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-73526541088989719392012-02-24T15:03:29.783+00:002012-02-24T15:03:29.783+00:00In between the 2' gauge WHR style railway and ...In between the 2' gauge WHR style railway and standard gauge there is a good compromise - Metre gauge. It would be big enough to have a proper size presence and it will fit with cyclists. (by the way, I support Sustrans and while they can be difficult, they are not 'hippies' and cycling will increase rather than decrease in the years to come) <br /><br />Metre gauge works in lots of EU countries as a proper part of the transport infrastructure but has never been tried here. That could be another possible answer but to think you are going to get the old S&D back except in small pockets of resistance is surely a pipedream.Howard Parkerhttp://everythinggwr.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-92169367368424895942012-02-23T07:16:01.018+00:002012-02-23T07:16:01.018+00:00If you look at the welsh highland/ffesstiniog webs...If you look at the welsh highland/ffesstiniog website, and transfer those images to Bath to Midford, as a Tourist Attraction,then what do you think? If there was no possibility of taking standard rail back into Bath, then it begins to make sense for an Entrepreneur to back it. And if the standard rail deviated at Midford to join the old Camerton branch and join the old GWR metals at Limply Stoke, then it makes even more sense. But if the aim is to get full size rail back into Bath down Devonshire Bank and to Green Park, then we are in a different scenario. At this stage there is all to play for. That's why it's such an exciting time!Richardnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-43783816823585388372012-02-22T22:04:30.135+00:002012-02-22T22:04:30.135+00:00There's certainly something in a transitional ...There's certainly something in a transitional narrow gauge section, and there have been precedents certainly outside of the UK. It's also common of course for bus routes to be upgraded to tramways, once they reach a certain level of patronage.<br /><br />The Waldenburgerbahn in Switzerland runs an intensive service on 800mm gauge, which is well under three feet. But the metre gauge is an excellent size, there's not a lot of capacity lost in passenger vehicles but a big saving in construction costs. Whilst a lot of Swiss railways cascade older stock and hang on to equipment for many decades personally I'd love to see, for example, a metre gauge feeder route between Oakhill and Binegar using Swiss metre gauge!<br /><br />Who knows what will happen?Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-51623554893868482362012-02-22T20:05:43.428+00:002012-02-22T20:05:43.428+00:00For a serious commuter potential - say Radstock to...For a serious commuter potential - say Radstock to Bath - would even 2' gauge might not give enough capacity? Metre gauge would be ideal as an interim, and maybe permanently for rural feeder lines, as they have in Switzerland. We might be able to get some second-hand rolling stock from the Swiss too!Freddienoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-28174768769747811332012-02-21T11:36:18.890+00:002012-02-21T11:36:18.890+00:00I'm not trying to play down prejudice - I don&...I'm not trying to play down prejudice - I don't agree with the comment! I was just trying to get behind the spirit of it.<br /><br />I really don't like censoring content on this blog - I've only ever censored one poster (CPO Man) because he's a well known troll and anti-rail person, but I don't think I've ever not published anything else, no matter how strongly I disgree with it.<br /><br />I'm sorry you were upset by this. We are doing everything we can to build a consensus between all sustainable modes of transport so this was a bit of an anachronism!Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-12480592946013259322012-02-21T11:00:37.995+00:002012-02-21T11:00:37.995+00:00While it is appreciated and understood that you wi...While it is appreciated and understood that you wish to play down that prejudice as a bit of joshing it would be well to realise that prejudice is commonly badly hidden in a cloak of "joshing". Ask any coloured or ethnic minority person. Some people would do well to engage their stone age brain before hitting keyboard.<br /><i>"Hippy cyclists won't be able to veto re-opening forever: once they die out, we'll see rapid progress."</i> is probably one of the most stupid comments I've read on any online forum.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-22485025421178402862012-02-20T23:04:56.382+00:002012-02-20T23:04:56.382+00:00It sounds a good idea to me.....but as mentioned i...It sounds a good idea to me.....but as mentioned i think it needs to be at the least a 2 foot gauge as it can carry good loads, think Lynton & Barnstaple...if it lasts 20-30 years in that guise it has paved the way. It would give the doubters the proof they needed that reinstating the line in full, and STD gauge is needed, and in those years they will see for themselves the end of affordable oil for the masses and the growth of new sustainable businesses that would grow up alongside the line and in so doing, when the upgrade to STD gauge happens, there will already be ample revenue earning potential established, passenger & freight, to make the full STD gauge reopening case a no brainer.Paulnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-7470565949148111782012-02-20T21:17:59.312+00:002012-02-20T21:17:59.312+00:00I think the 'hippy' comment was just a bit...I think the 'hippy' comment was just a bit of joshing - I'm sure we're all thick skinned enough to take a bit of banter! It's only a comment buried on a blogsite, not a policy statement and I very rarely don't publish comments, unless they are 100% stupid! I remember reading on a forum a few months ago that some traction engine enthusiasts regard all railway enthusiasts as paedophiles!<br /><br />I don't think WE'VE alienated anyone, many of our members are cyclists too, and I don't think I've met a hippy in the New S&D yet - closest we've got is Compulsory Purchase Man and his Occupy rants!<br /><br />I think certain 15" lines could be regarded as narrow gauge - certainly 18" can be, such as the Woolwich Arsenal Railway. I don't really think of the RHDR as a miniature railway, more a main line in miniature, which I suppose is pedantry too!Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-62195371257815715472012-02-20T20:53:37.817+00:002012-02-20T20:53:37.817+00:00"Hippy cyclists". Two words to alienate ..."Hippy cyclists". Two words to alienate a whole tranche of supporters. Well done.<br />Cyclists aren't necessarily hippies.<br />Hippies aren't necessarily cyclists.<br />Just sayin' - speaking as a white middle class house and car owning... cyclist.<br /><br />Stereotyping and imagined tribalism is always bad news, so best to keep one's prejudices to oneself.<br /><br />On the subject of narrow gauge. Well worth consideration in short/medium term before the big money comes in when the route is upgraded to standard gauge.<br /><br />Like the cycle routes, narrow gauge can help preserve the integrity of the route as well as providing a transport role. <br /><br />On a pedantic note, RH&DR was conceived and built as a miniature railway as a tourist attraction.<br /><br />Narrow gauge - 2 foot and above - was always constructed for work.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-92147162951479382852012-02-20T20:33:43.512+00:002012-02-20T20:33:43.512+00:00Keith- a balanced and well founded case.
RHDR is...Keith- a balanced and well founded case. <br /> RHDR is a mainly tourist railway- so is the Welsh Highland/Festiniog. Sure the RHDR is Shepway's premiere tourist attraction and even provides a schools service but it could only truly become a community railway if it got it's standard gauge connection back-either at New Romney or Dungeness.(there is a formative group.)<br />The Welsh Highland's rapid re-establishment is the the product of big busineess, dynamic financing and top line management.<br />You mention the preserved lines struggling to get their acts together and complex locomotive restorations taking years. The thing is that TIME is the currency we have plenty of. I have been involved in 20year loco renovations-and it doesn't matter about achieving completion of whole projects in a lifetime. Just making a contribution should satisfy those involved-the next generation will ply it along-and we have to consider our friends at Sustrans.<br /><br />In any case-I firmly believe that the concept of 'New S&D' is not necessarily about preservation in the known sense even though some of the constituents are. It's all about change and up grading to a level of community living in a sustainable world.<br />However I am not one promote closing of doors to intelligent, articulate and obviously informed ideas. I do agree with narrow gauge feeders and can imagine a scaled down train accessing the centre of Wells much more easily and unobtrusively than standard heavy rail!<br /><br />Keith I enjoyed your piece-and I'm sure it is welcome into the mix. Let's see what happens.Eddystonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980133067544256066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-78374545599661799292012-02-20T15:40:38.277+00:002012-02-20T15:40:38.277+00:00I do think that narrow gauge has its place, but re...I do think that narrow gauge has its place, but really as a feeder to the main network, and I think 99% of people would want a standard gauge route from Bournemouth to Bath. I do think that in 50 years' time there will be many narrow gauge feeders to the S&D linking to outlying villages, connecting markets and industry to the main line and providing tram services in many of the towns en route.Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-40057899984696309792012-02-20T15:36:38.592+00:002012-02-20T15:36:38.592+00:00There will be narrow gauge facilities plus track a...There will be narrow gauge facilities plus track at the Sustainable Engineering Works!Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-84947345319614905402012-02-20T15:35:43.010+00:002012-02-20T15:35:43.010+00:00True enough - and some of us are trying!
Notice t...True enough - and some of us are trying!<br /><br />Notice there was no modern narrow gauge British picture I could use to illustrate the post! (Pic is the Forchbahn in Switzerland, a super efficient, busy and profitable narrow gauge commuter line into Zurich).Steve Sainsburyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024394243500109831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-12959078370773061362012-02-20T14:58:00.839+00:002012-02-20T14:58:00.839+00:00Narrow gauge prevents inter-operability, so isn...Narrow gauge prevents inter-operability, so isn't worth considering for what is, after all, major regional infrastructure and a crucial part of our sustainable future. Hippy cyclists won't be able to veto re-opening forever: once they die out, we'll see rapid progress. Full-scale restoration may well be beyond the resources of rail enthusiasts but that's all the more reason to emphasise that it's a mainstream idea - think Waverley Line - and that big money will come on board once logic dictates this.David Robinshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15771605556010025142noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-36201678339801791612012-02-20T14:38:02.260+00:002012-02-20T14:38:02.260+00:00My piece was about flexibility of use and making t...My piece was about flexibility of use and making the best of what we have.The possible is a lot easier.<br /><br />Here is a short youtube clip of the Dom Luis Bridge in Porto. <br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtMOAdtJP88<br /><br />The other thing to note is that the Metro which was completed six years ago, is now being used as a multi-use conduit with a footpath/cycleway and small roads being built alonside in many places. This is creating a new footpath and minor road network.<br /><br />It works in Holland as well. The Brits need to catch up with the rest of the World.<br /><br />Keith BrowningKeith Browningnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-80649781794614620862012-02-20T13:43:25.433+00:002012-02-20T13:43:25.433+00:00http://www.thisisbath.co.uk/light-railway-instead-...http://www.thisisbath.co.uk/light-railway-instead-Tunnels/story-11349274-detail/story.html<br /><br />I like the idea of "as well as" a cycleway rather than "instead of". It is supposed to be a multi-use path after all.Tom Sealenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27589444.post-52344596747940601622012-02-20T13:41:05.216+00:002012-02-20T13:41:05.216+00:00For the foreseeable future the trackbed between Ba...For the foreseeable future the trackbed between Bath and Wellow will be occupied by the two tunnels cycle path. With there having been such a large push and financial investment in support of this aim it would be politic not to voice any track laying plans at this time - we would lose a lot of support. Sure, in the future things will be very different.<br />Best Regards,<br />StuartStuart Sealenoreply@blogger.com